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tennisgamers.com Forum Index » All Tennis: Mixed » Novak On SERENA Goto page 1, 2, 3, 4, 5  Next
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Posted: Sep Mon 10, 2018 3:41 pm       Novak On SERENA
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‘He did change the course of the match’: Novak Djokovic sides with Serena Williams in U.S. Open incident

“I have my personal opinion that maybe the chair umpire should not have pushed Serena to the limit, especially in a Grand Slam final,” the men's champion said.
     
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Posted: Sep Mon 10, 2018 9:07 pm       
Ace2Ace
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Yes but not as 3rd offense.
There is a difference saying bad thing as first offense.
If you already have 1 warning and you break your racket, you get a 2nd warning which automatically is 1 point penalty.
At that point, Serena should have known that a third offense would be a game penalty. And that's what happened.

The umpire did nothing wrong. All those accusations of sexism and whatever is silly. When Serena starts berating umpires, she doesn't stop. And that's bad. People should not stand by her when she does it. No excuse.

No one should teach his tennis students to attack and disrespect umpires like Serena does. This is not the first incident. She has to set a good example for the young players.

How many players shrug off a foot-fault or coaching violation?  Does anyone remember them? barely.
Has Serena ever seen an NBA player getting ejected for bugging a ref, talking trash to a ref, etc?
You got to let those things go. That's what every coach should teach.
     


Last edited by Ace2Ace on Sep Tue 11, 2018 10:12 am;
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Posted: Sep Tue 11, 2018 4:49 am       
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@ Ace2Ace:
 
Yup, I try not to comment too much on the whole issue, but agree with you.

1) the referee sees a coach giving instructions and the coach afterwards admits that he was doing so. So the warning (nothing more, it has zero consequences at the time) was in place. No need to call a referee a thief or asking for apologies for doing so.

2) then the referee gives her a warning after deliberately breaking a racquet (frustration because she is a break behind at a crucial stage in the match). He simply follewed the rulebook; players get warnings all the time for this type of offence, but because it is a second warning, it is a point... Osaka starts with 15-0 instead of 0-0. Not nice but not a disaster.

Again, I fail to see where an apology or accusations of "theft" have some validity.

Whatever happened after, can be debated. You could say that the referee could have done more effort to de-escalate the situation. But then again, he did nothing that warranted an escalation in the first place.

Serena said afterwards:"He’s never taken a game from a man because they said ‘thief.’ For me it
blows my mind, but I’m going to continue to fight for women.”
No Serena, he gave you a warning for you referring to him as a thief... It was warranted a warning. Unfortunately for her, a third warning = a game. And the decision to give a warning for a specific action should not be affected by the fact that previous warnings were given. If an action or remark is "warning-worth", so be it.
But she is probably right that Ramos never took a game from a man calling him thief, because no man was ever stupid enough to make such a remark after having received two warnings before....


Best thing  for Serena to do is to regroup a week or two and then actually play the Asian tour (Wuhan, Bejing). Two strong performances like at the US Open and Wimbledon and she is into the YEC.
If she is gonna have another resting period until the AO, then she has to realise that she cannot expect to be more match-ready than she was now, and girls like Osaka / Stephens / some others will keep on improving at the same time.

Wimbledon still looks to me like the event that she can be the main favorite with proper preparation and no injuries. I expect #24 to be there.




     


Last edited by Graveller on Sep Tue 11, 2018 5:10 am;

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Posted: Sep Tue 11, 2018 10:00 am       
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To all the people that say Serena would have lost, that's pure B.S too.
Nadal lost the first against Thiem 6-0, worse than Serena losing 6-2.
But Nadal took the next set to a TB and won.

Nothing said Serena would not have won the 2nd set. She had broken Naomi for the first time in that 2nd set. She gave the break back. They were on serve at 3-4. But she finally found out how to break the girl.. and could have done it again.
Serena could have won that 2nd set 6-4 or 7-5 or 7-6, and go on to win the 3rd set, just like Nadal did.

She took herself out of the match, with that stupid drama that really needed not to take place.
It doesn't matter whether she saw Patrick gesture to move forwards or not. The umpire saw it. And that's what matters.

People who support her in this instances are the one that encourage her to continue with such behavior.
     


Last edited by Ace2Ace on Sep Tue 11, 2018 11:02 am;
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Posted: Sep Tue 11, 2018 10:20 am       
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Can't ignore the racist, sexist ugliness in tennis.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-australia-45479954
     
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Posted: Sep Tue 11, 2018 10:32 am       
Ace2Ace
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That cartoon is an exaggeration of a character. That's what cartoon are most of the time.
People should gave those things the benefit of a doubt.
Unless they know this cartoonist is a racist, based on his previous work, they shouldn't cross that bridge. IMO, it depicted Serena the way she was on that court: angry, scary, yelling, abusing, out of control. How does one you put all that in a drawing?

So, before I agree it's racist, I have to see that guy's previous work.
Sorry, but Serena created this whole mess on her own.
     


Last edited by Ace2Ace on Sep Tue 11, 2018 10:43 am;
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Posted: Sep Tue 11, 2018 10:52 am       Re:Novak On SERENA
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umpires may boycott Serena Williams matches after outburst at us open

https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/umpires-may-boycott-serena-williams-matches-after-outburst-at-us-open-final-fwgv97swz

Agree. No one wants to be quickly called racist, sexist, bigot, for making a call in tennis. I can understand umpires trying to stay away from Serena as much as possible. It doesn't take much to be turned into an "ugly inside", "thief", etc.. .

So yes, if I were an umpire, I wouldn't want to officiate Serena's matches either. Who wants to be 1 call away from being called racist, sexist, etc ...???
One call, and your whole reputation is ruined? Nope, sorry.

Change-over times shouldn't be used to abuse refs
     


Last edited by Ace2Ace on Sep Tue 11, 2018 11:34 am;
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Posted: Sep Tue 11, 2018 11:10 am       
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So boycott. It only magnifies the double standard. Who has boycotted a top male players' match? I'm guessing not even the umpire whom Federer cussed out. Male players cuss at them ad nauseaum and no OTT reaction nor boycott.
     
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Posted: Sep Tue 11, 2018 11:13 am       
Ace2Ace
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Tell Serena to stop abusing umpires. That's all it's about. She has to set the example for young players who love her.
How many times Michael Jordan berated umpires for a wrong call?
We are all human. No one is perfect. But you have to know when to say when.

When you already have 2 warnings, it should be enough for you to take your losses and shut up.

We all have been in situations like that, where you know things could get worse for you if you continue, even when you think you are right: confrontation with an armed policeman is a fine example. Stop, take the order and go home. Sue him later. I have sued police officers twice and won both cases. ( I mean not sued.. gone to court for refusing to accept I violated traffic.. In both cases, the judges found the policemen were wrong)... I didn't put up a fight, call him names, etc.. he could have shot me right there. You have to know when to stop.
     


Last edited by Ace2Ace on Sep Tue 11, 2018 11:21 am;
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Posted: Sep Tue 11, 2018 11:16 am       
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@ Ace2Ace:
 
Tennis not basketball. The male tennis players berate them and much worse all the time with impunity. You see the tapes. The umps just nervously smile as them men attack. At least Roddick, Blake have the balls to say so. His reaction was markedly different, OTT and came at the most precarious time of the match. Very suspicious.

And MJ did in fact express himself strongly at officials, it was just not made a big deal of.
     


Last edited by Grossefavourite on Sep Tue 11, 2018 11:18 am;
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Posted: Sep Tue 11, 2018 11:19 am       
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The warnings are BS as Azarenka said and should be called out as she did then.
     


Last edited by Grossefavourite on Sep Tue 11, 2018 11:19 am;
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Posted: Sep Tue 11, 2018 11:23 am       
Ace2Ace
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@ Grossefavourite:
Quote:
Tennis not basketball. The male tennis players berate them and much worse all the time with impunity. You see the tapes. The umps just nervously smile as them men attack. At least Roddick, Blake have the balls to say so. His reaction was markedly different, OTT and came at the most precarious time of the match. Very suspicious.

And MJ did in fact express himself strongly at officials, it was just not made a big deal of.
 That's my point. People like MJ know when to stop. Serena doesn't. Because people like you keep defending her tantrums.
When are you going to hold her accountable for her angry behaviors.??? Is she a perfect human being that never made a mistake?
     


Last edited by Ace2Ace on Sep Tue 11, 2018 11:27 am;
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Posted: Sep Tue 11, 2018 11:39 am       
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@ Grossefavourite:
 My biggest "problem" is that there was absolutely no reason to act like that.

Most of the times, I can see why a player is protesting, but here?

The warning because of the coaching? 100% correct
The warning because of the racquet abuse? 100% correct (look at the state of that racquet).

And then she exploded.





     

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Posted: Sep Tue 11, 2018 11:41 am       
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@ Ace2Ace:
 
You can't compare team sport with individual sport as it's difficult to hear and see everything that's going on in a team sport, but in an individual, it's more evident and more impactful. It's almost impossible to hear the conversation on a basketball court between players and umps. Tennis, we get almost all of it. Apples and oranges in many many ways.

In any event, clearly the comparison here is between the WTA and the ATP and not between Serena and all of basketball.
     
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Posted: Sep Tue 11, 2018 11:42 am       
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I'm with Novak, Roddick and Blake on this all the way.
     
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